TOYAH ON
SUMMER SUNDAY
ITV TV-AM
WITH HENRY KELLY
19.7.1987

HENRY KELLY: It's 19th of July. I'm sorry it's a bit wet where we are in London, and it's not too good around the rest of the country, but we are delighted to bring a ray of sunshine into our studio and into your breakfast

The star guest of this morning, a lady who was once described as a punk rock rebel turned classical actress, and as a woman of 100 hair colors and countless chameleon disguises - it's Toyah Willcox. Who else would it be?

TOYAH: Good morning

HENRY: Good morning. A Birmingham girl and another Birmingham girl here with us every week

CO-HOST SALLY: We've both worked quite hard getting over it, I think

TOYAH: (they all laugh) Escaping

HENRY: And of course, Anne Diamond (another TV-Am host) is a Birmingham girl

TOYAH: There's nothing really bad about Birmingham I think but I love London. I went to school in Edgbaston. That's where you were born?

SALLY: No, I went to school in Edgbaston as well

HENRY: Did you? You didn't go to the same school by any chance?

TOYAH: No, we didn't

SALLY: A few years apart, of course. I think our schools may have played hockey or something

TOYAH: Oh, you bet. I'm vicious at hockey! (laughs)

HENRY: Did you play hockey at school?

TOYAH: Yes, I was always put in goal because I was fearless

SALLY: I played goal as well

TOYAH: You get your stick and you just run at them and go grrrrh! (laughs) No one dare come near you

HENRY: Toyah, what sort of childhood and schoolgirlhood did you have in general?


TOYAH: I went to public school. I loathed every minute. I found it criminal to be put in a uniform so early and to lose your identity and your individualism. I'm all for individualism in childhood. That should be developed, and artistic things should be developed, and creative things should be developed. I didn't have that kind of upbringing, so it was frustrating

HENRY: But they do say, and there's a point in it, surely, that children are not always capable of the correct expression of individualism and artistry and you put children in a uniform rather than let them separate too early?

TOYAH: Yes, when you give children technique. I think at some point we all need to learn technique. I wasn't capable of learning technique until I was about 18 onwards, and now, as a 29 year old, I love learning techniques, especially within theatre or within acting. As a child to be taught technique I found it like a brainwashing process

HENRY: By any stretch of the imagination you've done a heck of a lot in a very short space of time, haven't you? As I said in the intro from being a pop star, writing your own stuff, performing, acting and now at the moment in “Three Men On A Horse”

TOYAH: It's great. I love it. It's got very good reviews, which is just great. It's a fabulous American comedy, and I play a moll ("Mabel", below) in it. It has a brilliant cast. It's directed by Jonathan Lynn, who wrote “Yes, Prime Minister”, which I never got to see because I was always on the road gigging at that point. But as a director he was fabulous. It's a very good show, very enjoyable show

HENRY: You were interviewed once, and at the course of it you said, “I've always worn a mask. Now I'm looking for something from within” which, coming from somebody else might sound a teeny weeny bit pompous, but I don't think you could be pompous if you try. But what does it mean?

TOYAH: I think I can be pompous. I got a very big mouth and if people ask me a question I always answer it and it's always got me into trouble (laughs)

SALLY: Expression. Honesty

TOYAH: I think what it was that in the beginning I was doing things with the wrong motivation. I started singing really wanting attention and really wanting personal acclaim. And now that I've gone into theatre and into the West End, which is vibrant and has a life of its own, it's allowing me to discover something a little more important than just the physical self

HENRY: But you're able to say this and not in any way diminish the achievements that you've had in the past. Or do you regret another phase of your life?


TOYAH: I see the past as history, and it's as simple as that. It's gone, and there's only the future to look to next

HENRY: How excellent

SALLY: Do you feel that the past has brought you to where you are now?

TOYAH: Well, yeah. I think mainly the past in my personal life. The greatest lessons I've ever learned is observing my personal life and observing people around me. Work is always slightly false, because I've been in show biz for 10 years now, and you're always just put on pedestal. It's not real

The reality comes from looking at the outside world, which is why I think I like working to a live audience much better than, say, recording in a studio or something like that. I'm now aiming my life at doing more live work, i.e. stage and live work with a band, because that's real. You're in contact

HENRY: You're in an advantage too, because in a way you had a theatrical training, so that when you came to it, even having been in the pop world, nobody could turn around to you and say “oh, this is just the pop star coming in to take a good job in the field”

TOYAH: I actually started at the National Theater of all things. At the time I was so ignorant. I turned up at a National from Birmingham with a plastic bag full of sandwiches my mum had made expecting to go home the same day. I thought I'd just go for a day's rehearsals and of course I never went home again

I can remember phoning my mum up and saying “oh, Mum, I'm staying for nine months. The contract's for nine months” and she was terribly upset. I never realised the importance of the National Theater at that time

SALLY: How old were you when you went?

TOYAH: I was 18 and very blinkered. I had pink hair and everyone would just stop and stare at me. It was just the beginning of punk and I thought people were staring at me because I was nice. Not because I looked stupid! (laughs)

HENRY: You didn't look stupid. You looked different

TOYAH: I was very fat as well. I terrified people

HENRY: It's interesting because Sally, you were just telling me that you met somebody yesterday

SALLY: I saw Emlyn Williams, and he was telling me that you were in the film “The Corn Is Green” with Katharine Hepburn (below)

TOYAH: (really taken aback) Yes! And George Cukor was directing

SALLY: It must have been staggering to have that opportunity?


TOYAH: Oh, it was wonderful! The audition for that was staggering, because again, I turned up at the audition and didn't know who Katharine Hepburn was (laughs) I was like “hi, how are you?” and I made her a cup of tea. George Cukor was there, and I had a wig on, because I was at National Theater, and my real hair color was red at that time. I knew I wouldn't get the job if I went with red hair

At midnight that same day, George Cukor phoned me and said “you've got the job. Well done. Out of 2000 people. This is it. We're going to make you big star" and all that. The next day I went in without the wig, and George Cukor asked me if I'd like to take my hat off

I said “it's not a hat. It's my hair”. Katharine Hepburn loved it. She thought it looked like feathers and it did. It was in terrible condition. It really did look like feathers

HENRY: It's wonderful to see you in such a bubbly form, and obviously enjoying yourself. We're going to have time to talk to you as the morning goes on, and we'll look at the papers together

Later in the show

HENRY: Are you a Sunday newspaper person? I mean do you get the whole big pile of them?

TOYAH: No, usually sleep on Sundays. It's the only time I get to sleep. I enjoy the trash papers, I'm afraid. I just go through News Of The World in hysterics

HENRY: We tend to call them the more popular dailies

TOYAH: Well, I don't mean trash trash. I mean it's just blatant good fun, really. I usually get The Observer if I feel like being intelligent. But I must say on Sundays I'm completely blitzed

HENRY: You prefer to be windswept

SALLY: Toyah, I was wondering, have you ever done a summer season (of theatre)?

TOYAH: I haven't done a summer season, but I've done a variety show a bit like Les' (Les Dennis) new one. It was for a National Youth Day in Devon. We followed (on stage) the local conjurer, and Frankie Howard followed us

My husband and I came on and did this rock concert in the middle of a variety show. We got all these old'ish people up and bopping. It was very good fun

Watch the interview HERE